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Quick March 2013 Results - WestGamer
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 Post subject: Quick March 2013 Results
PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 7:43 pm 
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Quick March 2013
Overall Winner
Neil Sorensen (Grey Knights)

2nd Mark Bruce(Chaos Space Marines)
3rd Tom White( Space Wolves)

Generalship
Mark Bruce(Chaos Space Marines)

2nd Neil Sorensen Grey Knights
3rd Tom White( Space Wolves)

Sportsmanship
Andrew Hortin (Orks)

2nd Jon Schmidt (Orks)
3rd Alexander Danaford (Necrons)

Best Army
Rhys Kingdon (World Eater Legion)

2nd Andrew Hortin (Orks)
3rd Michael Hortin (Imperial Guard)

Blood Claw
(1st Tournament)
Rory Cooper (Tyranid)


Painting Peer Voted
Jon Schmidt (Orks)

2nd Troy Kealley (Imperial Guard)
3rd Aaron Wright (Space Marines)

Organiser Judged Painting
Troy Kealley (Imperial Guard)

2nd Jon Schmidt (Orks)
3rd Oliver Paun (Necrons)

Tank Ace (Tank vs Tank Kills)
Richard Owen (Grey Knights)


Top Gun (Flyer vs Flyer Kills)
Alex Lebrun (Tyranids)


Scalp Taker (Independent Characters/Monstrous Creatures Killed)
Alexander Danaford (Necrons)


Line Breaker (Infantry Units Killed)
Robert Hortin (Space Marines)
The complete results are available to download <here>.

Thanks to all of you who made the trip up, down or across to play at Quick March2013, we had 24 players.

Thanks to Richard Henderson and Grant Eakin for their help in running the event, Christopher Thomas ringer and Alexander Danaford, Rhys Kingdon, Evan Eakin, Jake Baldwin and Sean Russell for setting up and tidying up.

Please post any comments or feedback here or pmail me if you prefer.

Thanks

Gary


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 10:41 pm 
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Link to full results added above.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:26 am 
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Thanks Luke,

Also when I was checking the results I noticed that there was an error on Mark and Alex L's result sheet. The sheet had 5 instead of 10 tournament points written on it. I have updated this and although it doesn't change the awards it moves Alex up a place.

Thanks to everyone for supporting the event.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 7:29 am 
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Well done to all the winners... and good job to those who participated

It's one of my favourite events and a shame I missed it

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:48 am 
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After a disastrous start was happy to end up at 9th - thought I'd be going for the wooden spoon there for a while! Stoked with the painting award as there was some stiff competition there from Aaron, Olly and Jon Schmidt (who got my number 1 vote for his insane Ork army!) - actually over all there was a pretty good standard of painting I thought. That said I will be bringing something new to the table for next season as I think the Desert Rats have had their day in the sun ;)

Thanks again to Gary and Richard and the AWG team for another great event.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:05 pm 
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Quote:
Thanks again to Gary and Richard and the AWG team for another great event.

They always do a great job, So disappointed I couldn't make it. Looking at the results I would have been the top Eldar player (no others there :D )

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:51 pm 
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Quote:
Thanks Luke,

Also when I was checking the results I noticed that there was an error on Mark and Alex L's result sheet. The sheet had 5 instead of 10 tournament points written on it. I have updated this and although it doesn't change the awards it moves Alex up a place.

Thanks to everyone for supporting the event.
So you're saying that loosing by 2 points (but not twice as low i.e. not 2 to 4) gives you 10 points? Sweet! Could you check my first game's sheet against Alex D. as well? Pretty sure I lost by 2 (without it being 2 to 4) and he gave me a 5. That's probably where the confusion started for me.

That bumps me up to 4th place on Generalship, which is pretty big for ATC selection!

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:29 pm 
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Alex,

That's correct as per the player's pack a minor loss gets you 10 points.

I felt it was appropriate to correct the error in your round 6 score because you had no opportunity to question the result.

I only checked the round 6 sheets again because at the end of those games I had to enter the results quickly. At the completion of round six once I knew that Mark had scored the major win I knew you were no longer in the running for Overall or Generalship and didn’t pick up your mistake. From memory your results and the results from one other critical game were the last results submitted and I was mindful of the need to get the awards completed ASAP.

If I recall correctly I also had to ask you to complete the Sportsmanship and Best Army sheets as you had left the table but had not submitted your side of the paperwork. Unfortunately it is harder for me to check for errors when the data comes in piecemeal and I apologise for not picking up the error at the time.

However in relation to the round one error, I am not prepared to amend the scores further because I believe it would be inappropriate to do so at this time.

If you had advised me during the event, the change to your points would have resulted in you playing a different draw of opponents which may or may not have resulted in you placing higher or lower.

I’m sorry if this seems a bit harsh but I really think that once the event is finalised then the results should stand unless they are manifestly unsound.

There are a number of checks in place to ensure that the results are submitted and recorded correctly and although I also failed to pick up the initial error, there were I believe a number of opportunities for you to do so during the event given that the problem arose in round one.

The player’s pack details the scoring matrix and the scoresheet. I think it is a reasonable expectation that a player reference the matrix when calculating their results.

Both parties are supposed to confirm the results and initial them. If Alex completed the sheet and made the error, then the onus was on you to identify this as you both should have checked the results and signed them.

At the start of each round after the first, I included each player’s Tournament Points on the projection of the report that detailed the matchups and table numbers. The incorrect figure would have been displayed at this point. I know you were playing competitively so it reasonable to assume that you were monitoring your score.

In round 4 you defeated your opponent and signed off on the 20/10 score. I appreciate that this may be a bit of an obscure way of identifying the error in round one, but you have indicated you are keen to play at the ATC and attention to detail is important if you want to qualify. This was another missed hint I guess.

For my part I try to pick up any errors on the completed forms as I go along, for example like when I had to clarify with you whether you had given your opponent a four or a nine for sportsmanship.

Unfortunately whilst the current software package I use for running the event greatly improves the speed at which I can organise each round, it doesn’t have any inbuilt error checking that identifies if the points awarded to both players are correct. When I enter the data I try to do so consecutively for each player in the game as this makes it easier to identify any discrepancies.

In the first round, as yours was one of the first games to finish, I probably wasn’t quite up to speed and missed the error on your sheet. I am sorry that I didn’t pick this up. That however was my only opportunity to identify the error given my other commitments.

Luke has the option of amending your position and reflecting this in your Westgamer League score points if he feels that I have disadvantaged you.

I hope that this doesn’t disadvantage you and significantly affect your opportunity to play at the ATC.

Maybe there is a lesson here for everyone and a timely reminder about the importance of completing your paper work promptly and checking it’s correct at events.

Gary


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 9:46 pm 
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I too would like to extend my thanks to Gary and Richard and the AWG team for another great event, which time and time again you guys succesfully pull off.

You guys put alot of effort into the 40k community (and other systems) which is great to see, so once again thankyou guys heaps

:)

and cheers for the trophy its my first :p

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:23 pm 
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Wouldn"t stress alex. Pretty sure your in like flynn. I think the team could use your nids. The ATC i mean. I possibly may not be able to go so that would be another slot free. Pretty sure 1 or 2 people are dropped from top 10 by june 1st so expect to see you climb a place or too.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:59 pm 
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Thanks Duann. I hope you make it too, if our one game is anything to go by you're a great player, pleasure to play against.

Gary, I must apologise, again one of my posts was misunderstood: what I meant is that I am already 4th on Generalship after the changes to my turn 6 score that you have posted yesterday. Are you saying that you want to take this back? Please read the below if yes.

The scoring matrix is ambiguous, I was going to post this as feedback: the way it is worded, if you loose by 1 point you score 10. If your opponent scores double what you have scored you score 5 points. Technically, if you are in between these 2, the player pack does not tell you how much you score. In my first game, I lost by 2 points to Alex (8 to 10 I think) and he gave me a 5, so I assumed that it is how it works, as he is part of the club and is related to you so I assume he knew what he was doing. Mark didn't pick up on it either in my second loss so again I thought this was how it worked.

The issue did not come back until turn 6 because I did not loose a game until then. I scored 3 Major Wins and 1 win by 1 point, and all those cases were unambiguously covered by the player pack, so no issues there.

I'm sorry if I have caused confusion, but I was pretty excited when I saw the results, and wanted to confirm it. It is fine if you do not amend my turn 1 score, you make a good point about the impact it should have had in the tournament.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:08 pm 
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hey alex the players pack read as:

Minor Win: You scored ones victory point more then your opponent but less then doubleq: 20pts

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:13 pm 
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Image

This is what my player pack looks like.

EDIT: Oh and I am talking about minor Losses, not wins. Looking back on it yes I might have been able to deduce from the minor wins that it is 10 points, but in the heat of the moment I didn't question it and trusted Alex D., and Mark didn't pick up on it either after our game.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:27 pm 
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ok there is a typo in the players pack, that we can agree on. But also if u notice there is 30 points available in total for each game, so if they got 20, you get 10.

In no way am i tryin to embrass you or any thing like that, but surely its easy to see their is a mistake in the intended wording for the scoring system, if your opponent scores a minor win, you obvesly score a minor loss. same goes for the obves of major win and a draw. All that is required to figure this out is a little brain power (and please dont take this in a bad way) just tryin to help, so remeber that.

all in all i hope ive help you for future events :) its any easy mistake, and easy to learn from, cause im sure you wount do it again.

[quote="Innocent"]Image

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:30 pm 
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Yes but it shouldn't be the player's job to interpret or decipher a player pack, especially in the heat of the moment. As Gary pointed out, it was rush-rush after each game to get the results in, so the last thing I want to do is figure out the symmetrical properties of a scoring matrix :roll: Especially when my first opponent is part of the club and read the matrix wrong (sorry Alex, I really don't blame you, just trying to explain how the confusion happened).

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