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WestGamer :: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K
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Out of sequence shooting phases 40K
http://westgamer.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=24417
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Author:  Outcast [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Overwatch, pg 21 of the rullebook. 3rd paragraph. (an overwatch is resolved like a normal shooting attack and uses all the normal rules for range, LoS, coversaves and so on. Overwatch can not cause morale or pinning. Any shots fired do so as per snap firing.

So MCs can fire 2 weapons.

Interceptor, pg 38 of the rulebook. At the end of the enemy movement phase, aweapon with the Interceptor rule can be fired at any one unit that has arrived from reserve within its range and LoS. If used the weapon cannot be fired in the next turn.

Early Warning Override, pg 68 of the Tau dex. All weapons on a model with an early warning override have the Interceptor rule.

So a Tau suit with two weapons could fire both with Interceptor if u wished.

Author:  Wolflord [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Im with you that I think tau and monstrous creatures should be allowed to shoot 2 guns in overwatch and intercept.... However nothing in the rules you quoted says they do.

Author:  Outcast [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Quote:
an overwatch is resolved like a normal shooting attack and uses all the normal rules for range, LoS, coversaves and so on. So MCs can fire 2 weapons.

Interceptor, pg 38 of the rulebook. At the end of the enemy movement phase, aweapon with the Interceptor rule can be fired at any one unit that has arrived from reserve within its range and LoS. If used the weapon cannot be fired in the next turn.

Early Warning Override, pg 68 of the Tau dex. All weapons on a model with an early warning override have the Interceptor rule.

So a Tau suit with two weapons could fire both with Interceptor if u wished.
dont see how these words make it so unclear.

MC fires overwatch following all the normal rules for the shooting phase except as snap fires... so if normaly can shot with 2 weapons, can overwatch with 2 weapons

Interceptor, the wargear allowes you to shot all ur weapons as if they have the interceptor rule (obvesly note this is for the Tau suits which can fire 2 weapons)

really not that hard guys, stop tryin to jib each other with rules u dont actually know. Its quite clear n cut.

Author:  olly [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

It's also quite clear cut the other way

May shoot an additional weapon in the "shooting phase"

overwatch = assault phase
interceptor = movement phase

did a bit of digging and nobody on the internets has reached an overarching consesus, dakkadakka, warseer, advanced tau tactica all have varying opinions. It will come down to TO decision or a new FAQ

Author:  Outcast [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Quote:
an overwatch is resolved like a normal shooting attack and uses all the normal rules for range, LoS, coversaves and so on.
Straight from the rulebook.

Its all gd you can all play it wrong, till the FAQ it and see im right :)

Also dont get confuzed with, when they happen. Follow the rules for how it happens.

Author:  Thorhorsemen [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

I sent a FAQ email to GW so who knows they may well include it in May FAQ.

If you want a ruling for Mayhem, just ask me :twisted:

Author:  olly [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

"Shooting attack" and "Shooting Phase" are two very different things. This is the main difference I could find in other online 'discussions'.

Units perform a 'shooting attack' rules such as being a MC or multi-trackers only apply in 'shooting phase'. If the wording on overwatch said the unit has another shooting phase, I would happily agree (or until GW FAQ it)

things like attack bikes/tyranid thorax weapons get their extra shot still as it's in addition to shooting attacks and don't mention phases at all.

don't worry I'd rather my riptide fire it's plasma and ion at drop podding wolves :wink:

While I do think RAI to work in overwatch, RAW it does not.

Author:  Outcast [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Quote:
an overwatch is resolved like a normal shooting attack and uses all the normal rules for range, LoS, coversaves and so on.
.... really

Author:  Wolflord [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Quote:
Its all gd you can all play it wrong, till the FAQ it and see im right :)
...
If they FAQ it I can 100% guarantee they will get to shoot 2. And in all my games I will play it that you can shoot 2. But this is a pedantic rule argument, not what we think is right :P

Actually speaking of pedantic rules-arguing, I cant seem to find the rule that says you can only shoot one weapon at all.... I must be missing something, someone find me a page reference :|

Author:  olly [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Pg51, More than one weapon

I would prefer to run it as 2 weapons can shoot, but it is a rules discussion

Author:  Wolflord [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Well that settles it. The 'More than One Weapon' rules state 'he cannot fire both in the same Shooting Phase' meaning he can shoot as many as he wants in the Overwatch or Interceptor 'phase' :P Time for that 4xFlamer Crisis suit commander ive always wanted!

Author:  Thorhorsemen [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

For me it isn't a real issue, as historically I ran my Suits with TL weapons.

I like specialisation.

Author:  Thorhorsemen [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Quote:
Well that settles it. The 'More than One Weapon' rules state 'he cannot fire both in the same Shooting Phase' meaning he can shoot as many as he wants in the Overwatch or Interceptor 'phase' :P Time for that 4xFlamer Crisis suit commander ive always wanted!
That's RAW for you 8)

Author:  olly [ Fri Apr 26, 2013 7:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Nice find, I'd say case closed with that one! so 2x flamers in the shooting phase and 4 in overwatch and the impact field for more fun :twisted:

Author:  Matt-ShadowLord [ Tue May 14, 2013 2:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Out of sequence shooting phases 40K

Quote:
Nice find, I'd say case closed with that one! so 2x flamers in the shooting phase and 4 in overwatch and the impact field for more fun :twisted:

I hadn't commented on this thread because I assumed this was a joke rather than a conclusion. :D

Since it just came up in a discussion about why Tau are virtually invulnerable to Assault armies due to their "multiple weapon overwatch" I thought I better bring in an argument on the other side.

First though, before I go digging through the rule books, can someone confirm that anyone actually thinks that models can fire more weapons outside of a shoot phase than they can in their shoot phase? For example, Ravenwing bikers firing overwatch with their twinlinked bolter, their bolt pistol, a krak grenade and a plasma gun?

I don't want to spend time on debating an argument unless it's a real one. Thanks.

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